Justice Champion Spotlight: Larry Miller
The following interview is excerpted from a Fireside Chat at the 2023 American Workforce & Justice Summit between Larry Miller (Chairman, Jordan Brand Advisory Board), and Maha Jweied (CEO, RBIJ). The interview has been edited for clarity and length.
Could you share a little bit about how the experience of having a criminal record influenced your business decisions and your career?
Having a criminal background really impacted everything I did from a work and career perspective, because early on I made a decision not to share my background. I wouldn’t deny it or lie about it, but I wasn’t open about it. I had an experience early on that showed me that if I want to try to change my life and build a career, the best way to do that is to not tell people about my criminal background, because that will stop any progress. So for 40 years, I hid from my criminal background; I worked with people every day closely for years and they had no clue. And if I had shared that and been open about it, I don't think I would have been able to accomplish the things that I have in my career.
Having a criminal background was always in the back of my mind. For years, I had recurring nightmares, where I would dream that I was back locked up for something and trying to get back to my life. I had migraines so bad I ended up in the ER a number of times. And I know all of that was related to the fact that I was holding [the fact that I had a criminal record] in and afraid that if my background would come out, it would ruin everything that I had built.
One of the things that I regretted the most is when I would go out and speak to young people about my career, but I couldn't tell them about what I was able to overcome. I had to dance around it and not talk about that. And now, being able to share the entire story has made me feel like I'm able to really have more of an impact on young people.
How has your perspective changed since you started speaking publicly about your background?
My undergraduate degree is in accounting. Back when I was graduating from Temple University, the goal was to get hired by one of the big eight accounting firms. I spent the whole day in interviews and in the back of my mind, I thought, “should I share my story with these folks?” As far as they knew, I was a young black person graduating from Temple with honors, and they were interested. Finally, I got to the last person who was the hiring manager, and I thought, “I am going to share my story with this guy.” So I started telling him my background, and the fact that I'd been incarcerated, got my degree while incarcerated, the whole story. His face is changing as I'm talking – and not in a good way. He says, “Wow, that's an amazing story.” He reached in his pocket, and pulled out an envelope, and he said, “You know, I had an offer letter all ready to give you, but I can't give it to you now. I can't take the risk. And you know, I wish you the best, and I'm sure you're gonna do okay, but I can't take the chance.”
That was the point when I decided that I wasn't going to share this information. [To do so now] has been really freeing for me, and the response that I've gotten from people that I've known and worked with over the years has been incredible. When my daughter and I got to a point where we're gonna put this out there, there were lists of people that I wanted to talk to first, because I wanted them to hear from me and not from the media. At the top of that list were Phil Knight and Michael Jordan, and I reached out to both of them. It was just amazing to me the response from both of them. They both said, “Hey, this is an incredible story, you need to share it. And whatever I can do to help and support you, just let me know.”
Those interactions validated me, that I was making the right decision by sharing my story. I don't have to walk around worried or concerned that somehow people are going to find out about my background. For 40 years that was my life, so it's been pretty amazing to be able to not have to worry about that.
You talk in your book about the importance of businesses engaging in policy reform, to change our system of incarceration and open the doors for inclusive hiring. Can you share from a business perspective why it's helpful to be able to lend your voice to these kinds of reform efforts?
The reality is about 99% of people who are incarcerated are at some point going to get released. And the goal should be that they come out better people than they were when they went in. That's only going to happen if we do things while they're incarcerated to help people change their life and change their perspective.
Harvard Business School did a study coming out of my book, that found that the recidivism rate is at 77%. So 77% of people who get out of jail are back in jail within a couple of years. But if a person learns a trade or a skill, that 77% drops to 30%. If a person gets a bachelor's degree 77% drops to 6%. And with a master's degree it’s at zero percent. This is a clear indication that by providing educational and skilled trade opportunities will absolutely change people's lives and put them in a position where they can be contributors to their communities. I believe there's an incredible, untapped resource that's waiting to be utilized.
You make a point to highlight the importance of education for yourself as well – can you speak to that experience?
The fact that I was able to take advantage of [the opportunity to earn a college degree while in prison] was what changed my life. We have to figure out ways to get programs like that back inside the prisons, and we have to figure out ways to start teaching, training and educating people while they're still incarcerated.
At the end of the day, it starts with a desire to change your life. You have to get to a point where you say, “You know what, I don't want to live this life anymore. I want to change my life.” But then you have to look for the opportunities that can change your life – and if there are no opportunities there for you to take advantage of, then you end up having that desire, but you don't feel like it's realistic. But if you have that desire and see a path that says okay, here's how you can change your life and you can start while you're incarcerated, that’s what is needed. That's what it was for me. And the more I started taking classes, I started to believe that I really could change my life. If I do this, if I go down this path, I can change my life. I can get out of this system that I've been caught up in for however many years and I can do something different. For me, one of the goals is to create that path for people to be able to change their lives.
What would you say to hiring managers that might be struggling with the idea of becoming an inclusive employer?
I was at a conference a couple of weeks ago in Montgomery, Alabama. And one of the women who spoke there who had formerly been incarcerated, was now out doing great work, but people ask her about how she felt about getting this opportunity. The thing that struck me, she said, “You know, I don't look at this as an opportunity, I look at this as a privilege.” That's the kind of worker that you're going to get if you hire folks who have previously been incarcerated. They know they're getting another chance and are serious about changing their lives, so you're gonna get some of the most dedicated, hard working, loyal people that you can find anywhere. Some of the smartest, most creative, intelligent people I've ever met are people I've met when I was incarcerated. So figuring out a way to tap into that energy, that intelligence, that creativity – the companies that realize that and get involved are going to definitely win.
What advice do you have for the justice reformers as they consider how and when to partner with businesses to advance policy reform and change?
I believe that change is going to take cooperation between folks [like RBIJ] who do the work and the business community. For me, the business community is what's going to drive this work – through job opportunities, educational opportunities, or opportunities to learn a skill or a trade. Without the business community, we won’t go anywhere. We need corporations getting involved and saying, we want to support this, we want to give people another opportunity, and we want to figure out how we can change people's lives in a positive way. We have to work together to try to change the laws and policies [and have businesses change their own practices]. That’s the winning formula.