Note: this interview has been edited for length and clarity.

What is ReNForce?

ReNForce provides workforce development to system- or justice-impacted individuals reentering the workforce. We also train and work with businesses looking to employ justice-impacted individuals and help get them into the labor force. Just recently we acquired a supportive house to start housing and providing services for women in the Augusta, Georgia area returning from release from prison and/or jail.

What are some of the barriers facing people who have been justice-impacted who are trying to reenter the workforce?

For those of us reentering society post-release, the most immediate barriers are around employment. When I say employment, I mean the ability to find sustainable employment opportunities. I would also say housing, because there are so many apartment complexes and landlords that check backgrounds and will rule you out before they even allow you an opportunity to find housing. Mental health is another one, because there are so many mental health providers that lack trauma-informed knowledge or wisdom to provide support around those specific challenges post-release. When I say mental health, I also include in that substance treatment or substance use treatment, because there are so many individuals incarcerated due to substance use issues that stem from a time prior to incarceration and who haven’t gotten treatment while they’re in prison. So those symptoms can be masked, and then these individuals face the same challenges when they get out.

There’s a big push for individuals to be able to be educated while incarcerated so that when they exit incarceration, they can have opportunities for employment and career accessibility and advancement. But when they face these other obstacles, they aren’t able to do that.

You’ve advocated for occupational licensing reform in Georgia. Why is this a business issue?

Georgia is one of the top five states for businesses right now, and many of our businesses are thriving. That’s great news. But Georgia is also one of the states with the most people institutionalized in the penal system. We’re in the top five for individuals on probation or parole. So it’s a double-edged sword – because while we’re doing great business-wise, we’re not allowing Georgians the chance for reform.

The push for occupational licensing reform for me is both a personal and professional one. Prior to my own incarceration, I was a mental health provider in the state of North Carolina – and I struggled for three years to get those licenses back. I’m currently going through the process to become a licensed mental health provider in the state of Georgia, and I’m going through all this red tape and maneuvering through the system. At the same time. I’m hearing from other formerly incarcerated individuals in all sorts of fields that they’re unable to get these licenses. So now I can be an advocate not only for myself but for others who are facing the same things I did.

What I think is important to recognize is that the majority of people currently incarcerated in Georgia are going to come home. They’re going to return to their communities. And these businesses are thriving, and growing, and need to expand their workforce and talent pool, and those of us with criminal records are pounding the pavement asking for employment and we’re being told no just because we have an old record.  

These are qualified workers. So many of us look into entrepeneurship while we’re incarcerated. We have the skills of barbering, cosmetology, nursing, therapy, all sorts of things. But when we go to complete the application for a license, we’re asked if we’ve ever been convicted of a felony or misdemeanor, and then we’re denied because of our background, and we’re not able to move forward with that process and contribute to society.  We’re just as educated, we’re just as skilled, we’re just as knowledgeable, we can do as much as anyone else.

When you restrict people with records from the workforce, everyone loses money. And that’s where the business push comes in. If we start to include this group in the labor force, revenue is going to go up, retention is going to go up, productivity is going to go up, recidivism is going to go down, the prison population is going to go down, the number of people on probation and parole is going to go down. Occupational licensing reform would be a huge win for all of our communities.

Can you talk a little bit about why creating opportunities for justice-impacted individuals is a racial equity issue in Georgia?

When we look at the racial makeup of the state of Georgia, and the racial makeup of the criminal justice system, it’s impossible not to see it as a racial equity issue. Georgia is very well known for its historical context around slavery and the slave trade. And those legacies are still there. So when I think about racial equity, and occupational licensing reform, and social justice reform, I think of it as a continuation of the historical context of Georgia, and of what was done in Georgia so many years ago and what that still means today.

We have the fourth highest incarceration rate in the country. More than 60% of those incarcerated are Black or brown. That’s continually embedding Black and brown people in a type of slavery. When you’re in prison, you’re supposed to be rehabilitated, but instead we’re trapping people in cycles of poverty where they can’t get a license, they can’t put their skills to use. That, to me, is a continuation of the legacy of slavery – we’re keeping these people a kind of enslaved. It’s just a modernized version.  

What advice would you give business leaders looking to start Second Chance hiring, looking to start engaging on justice reform?

Just do it. It’s not a hard task. You can erase those stigmas that you have heard about system-impacted people. I created ReNForce so that business owners would know that they don’t have to go it alone. You can work alongside ReNForce and other organizations like us, to speak and work with system-impacted professionals like me who have been down that road.  

I think the biggest thing is that you have to be willing to give people a clean slate, and another change. Everyone truly deserves an opportunity to make whatever situation they’ve been in the right situation. So just start doing that, start giving those chances.

Around reform work, educate yourself. Align yourself with people in the movement, and look to some of the bigger organizations or local organizations in your are to find who’s doing the work you might be interested in. Whether that’s occupational licensing, policy work, voter registration, whatever it might be, find who is already doing that in your community and plug into that. Those local organizations, those local entities, they need your help to push those messages forward – so as much as they are important to you, you are important to them. Align yourselves, roll up your sleeves, and do the work. Above all, just do it.

When you’re not working, what do you enjoy doing?

I know this sounds crazy, but I just enjoy detaching. I shut down all electronics – cell phones, television, everything – and I just close my eyes and I relax. If I’m able to travel in that time, I’ll go somewhere and just detach, listen to nature, and truly put my mind at ease. What I enjoy doing changes from season to season, but in this season, that’s what I’m enjoying.

What’s a fact about you that would surprise people?

I think the thing that surprises people the most, when they truly get to know me, is that I’m such an introvert. I truly, truly love being alone. I love my me time. I love my alone time. When the pandemic hit, everyone was so worried because they felt they had to be around people. And that’s when my colleagues found out that I truly have no problem being by myself. And I really marveled at that – I really love myself enough to be by myself every single day.